Distant friend, long story/ramble

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Okay, super long rant. I’m going to try my best to condense this as best as I can and hopefully it all makes sense :sweat_smile:

So I have this friend, she’s a smaller streamer, I met her in the game we both play when she first started streaming. I’ve since been a big supporter and I think a good friend since. I’ve known her for just over 2 years now, but our friendship really started a bit over a year ago when I confided in her over a girl that had led me on for 6-7 months, who I previously had asked her for advice with. She was there for me, let me vent, we had a healthy friendship for a solid 8 or so months. Then a few months back, a good friend of hers who was previously absent and not playing said game, came back. I felt an immediate 180 and felt kicked to the curb. She was no longer initiating conversations, wasn’t inviting me to things she knew I had been wanting to do(went and did them with her other friend instead), gave me super brief responses or just wouldn’t respond at all.

There was this slow burn over the course of 2-3 weeks where I’d try to talk and hang out, but she’d just be dismissive and brief and seemingly get upset over me trying to hang out and play the game together. I decided to speak up and say something, ask if something was wrong, tell her that I felt she was being distant, to which she told me it was a me thing and that nothing was wrong, just that she wanted to hang with other people. Mind you this is a game we both had been playing together almost every day for the past 8 months, so maybe she had some burn out with me and had an excitement to reconnect and play with this returning friend, which I understood, but I feel as though that doesn’t really give way to treat me vastly differently? Anyways, after those 3 or so weeks, I wrote up a note basically saying I feel kicked to the curb and why, and was immediately shut down, invalidated and told it was just a me thing again and that she just wants to hang out with other people, I just wasn’t a part of those people anymore apparently. I decided not to argue or fight for anything, I just left things alone, I didn’t want to make things worse or hurt her feelings more. She told me she’ll leave me in her discords, leave me as a mod in her stream, but she wants to kindly part ways because “this isn’t friendship”.

Immediately after this, she removed my extra mod powers on her stream (All I did with it was do her thumbnails and run ads). This bummed me out because to me it just read as her not trusting me in a sense, thinking I would do something malicious with her thumbnails? Like she cared more about the fact that I had extra mod powers than our friendship or that how she was being was hurting a friend of hers.

After 2-3 weeks I slowly started coming back to her stream, I didn’t say much, just wanted to gauge how she was feeling. It was around this time she began or had been receiving harassment and stalking in the game we play because she chose to play with a certain person among the ranking community in the game. We talked very briefly, she seemed excited to hear from me, but not much was said, just plans made to do something in game sometime, which never ended up happening.

Slowly we began talking more, she did end up acknowledging how I felt before and apologizing for the way she was treating me, saying it’s never intended. It was nice to hear, a part of me wishes when she realized it, that she was the one to reach out and initiate a conversation to apologize, but it’s better than nothing I suppose. As time went on though the stalking got worse, she was being messaged personal things, someone was able to find out info about her, her marital status, address, phone numbers etc. So she began streaming less, playing the game less. We never found out who it was, she expressed being suspicious of everyone, uncertain if they found out these things through her instagram, or if it was someone actually close to her. A part of me was worried she might’ve thought it was me just because the recipe was there - have a fight, not talking, then starts getting harassed, then I come back to the stream, her later mentioning she doesn’t know who to trust, etc… I would hope, knowing me for nearly 2 years at this point she would trust me not to do that, but we’ve never met so, you never know. But I think that’s just me being paranoid and overthinking things, but I never ruled it out as a possibility.

Our friendship slowly returned to a somewhat normal, confiding in eachother, playing the game together again slowly, she was still predominately absent and offline because of the stalking, which I think ceased when she stopped playing with the guy from the ranking community. At one point during her stream she was leveling a character, I had talked to her previously that I’d like to join her on one of my characters as well as we were the same level. I joined in at some point because she was solo leveling. Her other friend joined the group too, but after a somewhat awkward 5-10 min pause of nothing happening he left the group, my friend messages me saying he’s upset and bitching. I guess it was a problem she chose to level with me when she had told him she wanted to just vibe and level. (I didn’t know at the time, but as I mention below, I assume at this point he was being overwhelming, but he had a problem with her leveling with someone other than him, despite being one of the only people she had been playing with for months at that point)

A few weeks ago she confided in me details about this friend. It was one of those moments where it’s like, oh, I had no idea he was like this, this is really bad and you know it is. He was smothering her, overwhelming her, giving her anxiety. He would watch her every move and just never let-up. He was a big part too why she stopped playing as much and being more absent. It seemed as though they were having a falling out, they had the same talk over and over for months now, her telling him to chill and not smother her but nothing ever clicked for him. His way of apologizing was gifting lots of subs to her stream, but continued treating her poorly and not respecting boundaries. It was here where for the next week she would finally really start talking to me again, inviting me to things, and hanging out in discord. It felt like how things were before he came back months ago. It felt really good! So I know she hasn’t exactly changed as a person, she’s still capable of being that way, just… has chosen not to be.

I know she’s been going through a lot, with the streaming, harassment/stalker, marriage issues, this friend of hers, I never really pushed for anything, I didn’t want to contribute to any kind of anxiety or smothering, and tried to not take anything personally.

She told me a lot of things as far as what she wants from her friendships, wanting natural, healthy friendships, this sounded great to me because this is what I want too! I want to hang out and play the game with my friend, for them to invite me to stuff (especially her since, with all the stalking, her friend and others watching her every move, me simply asking how she is, or noticing if she’s on the game and messaging her, I risk triggering her into thinking I’m just watching her every move too, so that sucks)

A few days later after she last vented to me, we hadn’t really spoke much, she was back to being brief and feeling uninterested again. Turned out they talked and were back to doing everything almost exclusively together again. For the past 2+ weeks I’ve felt invisible, again reverted to not being inviting to things, not being hung out with. I initiate conversations but have only really been given brief responses, sometimes she doesn’t bother responding at all. This isn’t the person I know, and I don’t know if she’s this way because she’s truly uninterested in our friendship, or only sees me as a back-up friend or afterthought when it’s convenient to her, either way I don’t like it. She’ll talk to me and vent for hours about something bothering her, but recently any time outside of that, she’s just… gone? I’m a bit confused by it, I know she has the ability TO actually talk and respond and not make me feel like she can’t be bothered to have a conversation.

And I don’t want to get all conspiracy or speculate on it, but as an overthinker I feel I kind of just wander there anyways; I can’t help but feel this friend of hers is in some way manipulating her to really only talk with and spend time with him, like guilty tripping her if she spends time with anyone else(at least it seems that way from what I’ve seen and what she has shown and told me[this also makes me weary of the possibility that he could have been the one to harass and dox her previously, but that’s also probably a huge stretch, but eh… I don’t think it’s an impossibility]). Or they have some kind of unhealthy attachment to eachother, or some form of stockholme syndrome, maybe that’s also a stretch, I’m not sure. The part of me that feels abandoned and ditched is just trying to make sense of why my friend is making me feel this way again, and just a bit worried for my friends well-being, I don’t want her to fall into the same cycle again and again which seems to correlate with how she’s treating me at a given time. I don’t think it’s my place to say anything about her other friend to her, I just don’t want to feel this way anymore and I’m not entirely certain how to approach it again.

As I did a few months ago when I mentioned how I felt, I wrote up a note, I’m not the best with these confrontational things, I tried my best to express how I feel and be a bit more direct. I beat around the bush a little last time to attempt to avoid hurting feelings but I don’t think it helped as I don’t think she understood me well enough. I know I could for sure word things better, I think I sometimes can write things poorly but I just don’t know how else to write it to get my point across. But I feel I’m at that point again with this friend where I need to say something sooner rather than later. I don’t want to get to that point where I resent them. I’m also not sure if I’m being selfish, or needy or what, I don’t really feel like I am, but!

Here’s what I have at the moment:
~~
Kinda bummed you’ve felt distant and seem uninterested in talking, doing anything, or involving me in anything lately again. I don’t know if this is just a repeating thing due to certain circumstances? A misunderstanding? Maybe I’m just being unreasonable and sensitive again. I listen to and absorb what you tell me and I guess I don’t get it because it feels like you say one thing and do the other sometimes. I could guess, but we know that won’t solve anything since… you could just tell me if there’s a problem, if I said or did something wrong, or if you just don’t want to do stuff, or I’ve been relegated to that friend you only come to when you have an issue with a select something going on, which… I am and will always be here for as best as I can be, but I’m honestly not here to just be an ear for you.

That’s unfair to me when I’d like to also play the game and have fun with my friend, but I can’t do that when you don’t invite me to anything, and it feels wrong at the moment to ask to join because then that’s kind of asking me to do the thing you don’t want and that’s to keep an eye on you so I can actually know when you’re on and doing something. I don’t want to risk triggering you by asking, but I also don’t have many b.net and discord friends/DMs, I don’t have to even be trying to see what people are up to to notice what they’re doing or if they’re on. I see your @'s in the guild discord looking for a healer for stuff that I’d like to do too… but by the time I notice those it’s long past, and I guess I’m just confused why a DM or a whisper in-game isn’t possible? And I don’t feel like I can be the one to invite you because I never actually know when you’re around or available or if you’ll even respond. I guess I just don’t like this feeling like I’m just some random acquaintance or viewer half the time, that I’m in some way not deserving of being reached out to or conversed with.

I just want to be included, to hang out and play the game with my friend if they’re on, and not just… disappeared on… that’s all I’ve asked for previously as well, and if you don’t want to include me or invite me to things then I guess keep doing what you’re doing and I’ll get the hint, but if you’re going to tell me things that have me feeling like you think of me as a good friend, enjoy my company and want me around, could ya at least invite me, or talk to me sometimes; I don’t think I’m asking a lot? I mean, you’re not obligated to do any of those things if you don’t want to… but again I guess I’m just basing my expectations and hopes on the things you’ve told me in the past and recently so, I’m confused. I just want to feel valued or like I belong and not invisible.

And if I’m being honest, it feels like I’m part of some dynamic you seem to have with (–other friend–) where if he’s not around, or things are shakey, you’ll talk to me, hang out, invite me to things. When he is around and things are fine, you’re distant, and feel uninterested in our friendship. I don’t know why that is but that’s how it appears to be.

So, I would hope it goes without saying but I’m saying it anyways, I’m sure I could word things better, but I’m not attacking you and I don’t want to hurt or make you feel bad, but I know the risk and how this kind of stuff makes you feel so I apologize for this and my ass being a sensitive person. But again, I have feelings and boundaries too and I’m again expressing them to you. I don’t know if you expect me to be okay or not somewhat hurt by not being asked to be involved in the one game we play together, or most of our conversations lately being brief or unresponded to. I just feel confused. And I’m nervous to tell you all this because I don’t want a repeat of what happened last time. I too want a healthy friendship but this doesn’t feel entirely healthy to me. I care about you and our friendship and I hope you do too, so I’m voicing all this sooner rather than later.

Anyways, I know you say ‘there’s always something’ and I hate that I’m now that person with that something, but I really hope you’ll be willing to just talk and maybe we can try to better understand eachother and put whatever it is to rest.
~~

I know the things that could be replaced or written better, I’m just not sure how. Any help or advice or input on it, or the situation as a whole is greatly appreciated <3

edit - I don’t think she means to be distant, I don’t think she’s really even aware of it, so I don’t want to come off too confrontational, or accusatory since I know it’ll probably catch her off-guard or feel as though I’m calling her a bad friend and calling her out for something she isn’t even aware of, which is kind of what happened before. I just don’t know how to do that.

edit 2 - I also wonder if maybe instead of a long note I keep it really simple and just say like, ‘Hey, I feel there’s been a bit of distance again lately that has bummed me out a little, can we talk about it?’

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Hi Dingbat!
Thanks for posting, I hope that felt good for you, as ranting usually does. It can hurt a lot, the feeling of being super tight then left on your own, your friend suddenly being cold to you even though you’ve showed her nothing but care and support. Seems like the coldness isn’t because of you, but one of her friends, correct me if I’m wrong, of course. That can happen and it’s not fun for you as well as your friend, being overwhelmed only for him to apologize and not take action. Anyways, I’m proud of you for sticking with your friend, sounds like she has a lot going on and appreciates having someone there to talk to. Also remember to keep your own feelings in mind, you have every right to take a break if things become too much.
I’m not the best writer, but that seems like a solid message to start. Perhaps give it a day and see if you want to change anything.

Here for you
-Gremlin

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From: Manni XP - Snow Edition

You seem like a very caring friend. Your situation reminds me of one that I went through. It presents a rather unique challenge since it doesn’t even let you know how to feel (because you don’t even know what’s going on half the time). In my experience, this can really lead one to try to “figure it out.” That sort of speculation, though, can drive you nuts - I know it drove me nuts a few times - since we can’t know exactly what’s going through our friends’ heads (not all the time, anyway). As painful as it may be, sometimes the right move is to simply say “I don’t know what’s going on here” and back away from the situation until it makes a bit more sense. Remember that as much as we want to be there for our friends whenever they need, we must also take care of ourselves - especially if/when those friends cannot take care of us.

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Hi there @Dingbat,

Welcome to HeartSupport; we’re glad to have you here.

That’s such a rough situation to be in! Feeling sidelined by a friend can be such an isolating, frustrating experience, particularly when they had been so close to you. Hurtful messages like “this isn’t friendship” are never a good way to resolve interpersonal challenges, and I’m sorry that you had these directed at you – I know that they can be so impactful.

I also recognize that the uncertainty present in these situations can lead to much concern, so I hope this uncertainty isn’t bringing too much of an emotional weight down on you.

Your actions are responsible, and you are being a good friend by trying to reach out and help resolve frustrations that are present in the friendship. You express this perfectly when you say “I care about you and our friendship and I hope you do too, so I’m voicing all this sooner rather than later.” Furthermore, you express that this friend doesn’t intend to hurt you, and this is such a mature viewpoint. Oftentimes, these sorts of interpersonal challenges can feel like deep personal attacks rather than honest misunderstandings so I’m appreciative of your rational view of the situation.

I know you’re also asking for some advice in terms of how to write a message to your friend. In short, you have a well-written message and you’re empathetic enough not to blame the friend for what’s going on and you seem to have an open mind in the message. All of that is great. With that said, I’d suggest trying to trim down the message to be a tad shorter and/or trying to discuss most of this in a call with the friend. In my experience, talking directly generally helps to ensure that your intended expression gets across and minimizes miscommunications.

With that said, this is a really rough situation, but I have faith in you and am glad that you’re sharing with us. Please don’t hesitate to make another post if anything further is on your mind or if you have any updates.

<3 Tuna

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Hi friend, I totally understand the struggle of having a friend in the streaming community begin to sideline you. One of my friends I have in person has done something similar. All he cares about are his followers now instead of us. It’s such a sad situation to be in, my heart goes out to you immensely for all of this.

I’ve been in situations where I was prioritized, and then tossed. And then prioritized, and then tossed. My ex was a big player in that, for sure. It leaves you in this constant state of limbo and gives you a horrible sense of “what am I doing wrong? why am I being treated like this?” etc etc.

My ex did this too. He’d want to “start again” and “build our friendship back up first because we were toxic for each other”-- but never put in any effort himself. I was the same with being very well intune that he was going through things like you are with your friend-- but as I learnt way after countless people told me (definitely got several “I told you so’s” on that one) they need to put in effort themselves as well. You can’t be the only one trying to fix this. That’s toxic on their part.

Me and my ex went back and forth with things like this too. I felt towards the end of our time “together” (whatever it really was, since he led me on for eight months after our “break”) that I wasn’t supposed to tell him how I feel. But he’d constantly vent to me. We had prior issues with me sharing things, so I felt like I was just supposed to sit there and shut up about my own problems, despite him telling me to “come to him when I had an issue”. I digress with that, but in my own sense it made me… actually resentful towards the end because I couldn’t say what was on my mind.

Regarding your note, I’ve learned in therapy that conflict resolution works best when you both go through it together. I’m going to send this to you to hopefully help you through these times.

I would recommend with filling this out, that learning about setting boundaries ( Setting Boundaries: Info and Practice (Worksheet) | Therapist Aid ) for yourself would be very beneficial for you. Along with being able to post freely here, I would like to share this resource as well if you think that journaling may also help aid you some in the future: How to keep a mental health journal

Take care hun, and please feel free to keep us updated. We’re here for you, whenever you need someone.

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Thank you, I do care about her, but you’re right I need to keep my own feelings in mind and care for myself too. I feel this hot and cold with her has me feeling really anxious at times, and I can’t allow for it to continue because it’s hurting me and doing me no good as a person. I’m nervous to message her, knowing her… I just have that gut feeling it’s going to overwhelm her again and the reaction won’t be well, but! I think if things go south again and I continue to feel like my feelings aren’t valued or like I’m not worth having a genuine talk with to understand eachother then I guess it’s meant to be huh :person_shrugging:

I’ve sat on this message for a day now, going to sit on it another day or two and see if I find anything I feel needs changing. But I think I do send it, no matter how anxious I am to, it’s for the best for me either way.

Thank you! Yeah I’m very much a, ‘have to figure it out’ person. If I’m missing details or there’s a lack of communication or something feels off then I get in my head about it and yeah… drive myself nuts lol The unfortunate thing is, this friend always has an answer to something, I know she has a hard time dropping her guard, and does have a bit of an ego. And as she has told me before “there’s always something” so every little thing coming her way I think she just assume and takes as an attack and is ready on the defensive to protect the imagine of her self in a sense. So, I’ll do my best to be gentle and caring in my approach, but I’m kind of just expecting the worst because of it unfortunately. She has been there for me in the past, she’s really good at it in truth! But if the thing I need help with is some way she’s being or making me feel, she’s gone and can’t handle it or doesn’t know how to deal with it. So, hoping for the best! expecting the worst =/

Thank you! Yeah… the first time we had this encounter it didn’t feel good, both leading up to, and even more so after. She said some hurtful things and just… had a very bad knee-jerk reaction to me stating how she was making me feel. It was unfortunate because there were times in the past where I did something to hurt her. I would listened to what she told me and adjusted and respected those new boundaries. I just wish she had the same kind of patience and understanding in return.

Unfortunately I’m really anxious and overthink a lot. I don’t have too many friends because I’d prefer to just have a few really close friends, any more than that and I can’t really handle it, I get too overwhelmed and feel I have no energy for anything then. So when one of these friends is feeling how she feels and making me feel this way I do feel really weighed down by it.

Yeah I know she doesn’t intend to hurt me, and I don’t intend to hurt her, I’m just trying to bring something to light and make her aware of it so that maybe my needs as a friend can be better met.

I try to keep messages like this short, but I always end up adding “just another sentence” and that turns into a paragraph :sweat_smile: I may want to try to talk over voice, I know it’s a tad more difficult for me as I don’t necessarily have the ability to type, edit, re-read, and edit a response. Last time she wasn’t exactly willing to get in a call with me, so… I’m hoping after that she has grown just a little bit, maybe the message is better this time around, hopefully she’ll be willing and open to it. I just kind of hate that I’m at that point with a friend, anxious just to talk about something in fear of it not going well and potentially losing this friend. I know in the long run if that’s the case then it’s probably for the best, just sucks though.

Thank you everyone for your replies, I really appreciate it! I’m going to sit on things another day or two, re-read my message a few more times and tweak it just a tad and go from there. Super anxious, but that’s just how I always am with this kind of stuff :person_shrugging: I unfortunately don’t have high hopes for a good outcome, but I appreciate the input on the message. I wasn’t sure if maybe some parts were coming off a bit too aggressive but it seems like it’s okay? So I guess it’s really just on her at that point and her ability to respect it and show me some compassion and understanding towards me if she cares. All I can really hope for I guess.

I may post any changes to the message if I have any in the next day or so.

<3

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