Mixed Signals, but Nothing?

HeartSupport Support
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Hi, I’ve been in these forums for a few weeks now. I am having a deep internal struggle right now. So there is this girl. I met her at work last year. I mentioned her in a thread I started once before. Anyway, long story short I fell in love with her in the Winter and told her how I felt and that I wanted to go on a proper date with her. She told me that she didn’t “feel it.” So, I was like “okay” I’ll still be her friend and I’ll just have to get over it. A few months go by, we still talk, but no where near as much as before, no more snapping everyday and all that. Then, out of the blue earlier this month she asked me to help her train for a fitness test for her college she will be attending this Fall knowing I was a Varsity athlete. So, I said sure and we’ve gone running a few times in the last few weeks, but she’s been all over about hanging out with me and running a lot all of sudden, especially during quarantine, so I thought that was odd. Then, the other night she tells me about how she went on a date with some guy and she gave him a handjob and then he never talked to her again after. So, she messaged me being really upset, and I, still having feelings for her, thought that now would be a good time to let her know I’m still there for her and still have interest and that I’d never make her do anything like that for me and let her down like all her bad bf’s she’s had like that before have been. She avoided the question, so I asked her to straight up tell me that she isn’t interested and that she never will be, so I can move on. Then she proceeds to tell me she “doesn’t know” if she is. So, I asked “what does that mean?” And then she said that she has a problem of “liking everybody” and doesn’t want to lead me on. So, I said I’d rather have her go out with me a few times and then just tell me it’s not working than just forgo the idea at all. And to that she said “I just don’t feel the butterflies.”

So, she is a really good person and I know someone is going to say I shouldn’t be upset because I have a friend who cares about me. But, I don’t get it. She’s so nice to me all the time, I go out of my way to help her and do things with her, I’m like the first nice person that’s ever asked her out and wouldn’t completely fuck her over. It’s making me so upset because it’s not like it’s case where you love someone and they don’t know you exist. To me it feels like we’re almost in a relationship, so then I want one and I’m just told no. And again, every guy she’s dated has used her for money, sexual things, etc because she doesn’t have high self esteem and confidence, but then when I walk up and be the opposite of all of those and treat her so right she still finds guys like that and then cries to me. I love her, so much. But, it hurts me to hang out with her all the time, and have so much love, while she just sits there and continues to hurt herself with her bad decisions, but not give an actual good, nice guy like me a chance. I don’t want to just stop talking to her and end the friendship, because I’d feel so bad, but sometimes I feel like that’s the only way I’d ever get over it because she’s literally the nicest, most perfect girl I’ve ever met, I can’t stand to watch her hurt herself, and I’ll always be reminded that I wasn’t good enough to help her apparently. I would really appreciate some input. Thank you so much if you read this!

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Ik you said you wouldn’t want to end the friendship but if it’s hurting you being friends with her then you should definitely end the relationship. It might be harder for you but it would be one of the only ways you would be able to get over her. As long as you end on good ish terms then you will be fine and it will give you more time to think about yourself. You should tell her how you feel and how hard it is for you to be around her with all the feelings you have.

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Thank you Sandia for your two cents on the situation. I’m still conflicted- she means so much to me and she’s always been there for me when I’ve told her about my suicidal thoughts and she’s even expressed hers to me too. The other night I called her and we were talking and she even started crying because she told me she feels like I’m such a nice person and she hasn’t “returned the favor” to me. So, I feel like if I leave her life, as much as it may be hurting me emotionally, I feel like she’ll have no one and be just as upset as I feel right now.

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Yes well i actually went through some thing similar with my boyfriend so it was different but i had talked to him about my feelings and he shared his and i felt the same way the if i left even though i needed to that i wouldn’t have anyone to talk to about my problems or that i would be comfortable with. So can i ask are you more worried about yourself when or if you leave or about her?

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I think the first thing you should do is try to talk to her about how you feel. And ofc u don’t have to stop being friends with her cuz thats completely up to you but i do think you shouldn’t hang out as much cuz that is gonna make your feelings grow even more and your gonna find more things and reasons to love her when you even know you shouldn’t but its not your fault either way you can’t control how you feel and neither can she.

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I think if I’m being completely honest I’d be more concerned about her if I left because she’s always telling me I’m the best people in her life and I feel like she means it because she tells me almost everything about her life and comes to me for support about as much as I go to her when I need it.

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And, I think I will sit down and tell her everything one day. When I told her I still had feelings for her the other day when she came to me it was over text and that of course doesn’t convey everything from either of our perspectives, and not that I’m saying I think that means she’ll like me if I tell her that in person, but maybe she’ll at least get a little more perspective from me emotionally and me from her. Again, thank you Sandia for your opinion on the matter.

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Yes of course i am always here to help :slight_smile: I hope that one day is soon too good luck!

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From: dariandaotter

We all love you! -OtterFam

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Been here before. We met in college, we spent the whole summer together eating, talking, working out, and even wrestling each other. I told her I liked her, and she said she just liked me as a friend. I went on being her friend, until one fall night at a party I drove her home because she was super embarrassed after getting caught blowing a guy. I told her it was okay, she wasn’t a whore, she was a good person, etc etc. Then when she was home the anger came. I’d been used again, and I vowed I’d never harbor another crush because I was tired of getting hurt comforting my “friends.” A month later, I met my first real girlfriend. We hung out for awhile, I told her I liked her, and we were together for 5 years; but I was ready to move on, with my time and sanity intact, if she didn’t feel the same way.

Guys are brought up with the message that men are jerks and scumbags. When we’re young, we think “not me, I’m good and I’m going to be different by being good.” So when we find girls we like, we go out of our way to be good, kind friends to them in hopes that they’ll fall in love with us, and we continue doing so even when they say they’re not interested romantically. Like The Offspring say in “Self Esteem:” “The more you suffer, the more it shows you really care, right?” We then begin to doubt ourselves, our attractiveness, and our worth as romantic partners because the girls we like don’t like us back, no matter how good we are to them.

I had plenty of girls who were just friends, who I had no ulterior motives with. That’s healthy and pure friendship. I also had a lot of girls I had crushes on, who said they didn’t feel the same way but liked me as a friend. I hung onto those, being an “awesome friend” in hopes that they’d come around; but in doing so there was an agenda behind my “friendship.” It wasn’t pure. That’s something that “good guys” do with the best of intentions, but it’s disingenuous and selfish.

She for her part is testing and using you, whether she realizes it or not. She wants a non-judgmental friend to comfort her when she messes up, and she knows that you’d never say anything disparaging to her because you’re an “awesome friend.” It hurts when she comes to you with that kind of stuff, right? Because you like her and you wouldn’t treat her that way, and she knows that, but she’s still going after guys who end up hurting her. Now how is that fair to you? What do you get out of swallowing your pain and putting on a reassuring smile and being her friend when you want to be so much more? Will this time or next time or the time after that be the time that she looks up through her tears and clearly sees that you’re the one, that you were always the one? Unlikely.

You’re pinning your romantic hopes on a girl who is unlikely to reciprocate them. Her telling you that “she doesn’t know” if she has or will have feelings for you–even when you ask her directly–is her not wanting to hurt you or close the door on your friendship. It’s damaging your self-esteem and potentially holding you back from some really great dating opportunities. You don’t have to get ugly or tell her to go to hell, but if you want to move on on good terms, practice Letting Go With Love. Essentially, tell her that you’ll always care about her, but you need to set some emotional boundaries for your own good, and you can’t be caught up in her life anymore. Then you need to follow through and move on. It won’t be fun for either of you because you and she are each losing someone the other cares about, but if you wait for her to come back, the cycle will start all over again, only worse because she will have a better sense of how tightly she has you wrapped around her finger.

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Hey thanks SheetMetalHead for sharing your story and thoughts on the situation. I am aware she won’t ever come around and tell me she likes me and it’s a hard pill to swallow knowing I’ll have to be there for God knows how long supporting her when she messes up, but I’ve been thinking a lot and sometimes it’s not all bad. She’s always there for me and shows great concern always checking to make sure I get home alright and stuff like that. Unfortunately, I know it’s probably going to be a decent while before I have my first serious relationship seeing as 90% of girls in high school fall for assholes for some reason. But, like I said I’ve been thinking and I’ve already started to get over her even after a few days since I went out and told her how I feel again. Who knows I might be single my whole life, but I think right now I was especially upset when I posted this last night because it’s quarantine and we’re all home, lonelier, and have less opportunity to go out and meet that someone. She’s going away to college this fall anyway (assuming it’s opened by then) and I’ll probably see her a great deal less, so I think that will help me out in the long run. Plus, it will be my senior year in high school and maybe I’ll finally find that someone, or at least a first relationship in general. I know that the idea is I should do what is best for me to make me not suffer, but again, after Sandia said her two cents and wrote her thoughts it made me realize I’m more concerned about how she’ll be without me seeing as she doesn’t have much emotional support otherwise. As with many things I have a slightly newer perspective and I think I’m ready to move on from seeing her as a romantic partner, like I said the fall and going back to school will help. It’s nice to know someone had a very similar situation though SheetMetalHead and I again really appreciate your story and thoughts and it’s helped me think through my perspective of what’s best.

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She has her own issues that she needs to deal with first before she can ever be with a good man. You need to walk away from this situation and spend that time with a girl that can receive all you have to offer. It is not your place to save her. You can give her advice but don’t keep yourself in a situation that just causes you pain. Jesus saves us. She has to heal from the reason why she lets guys use her.

There are other nice good girls out in the world.

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Also if you extend out a hand of friendship let it be just that. She sees you as a friend and probably won’t be able to see you as more. I also commend you on voicing your interest in her as more than a friend not many can do that!

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Thank you Saralee. I’m having second thoughts on the matter. A few weeks ago I thought I could man up and get over her, but I can’t. She wants to hang out like every single day of my life and it hurts so bad. I want to go home and cry everyday after. It’s torture- she’s there and we hang out together all the time like we are a thing, but we’re not. And makes me most upset is she’s slept and done tons of stuff with so many guys who are all dicks to her and leave her right after (even recently), but then I didn’t even get a chance for a date. That sounds selfish and I know I sound super entitled saying that, but I just mean it hurts emotionally. I want to cut ties with her so bad, but she knows many of my friends, and she works with me. I don’t know how I’d do it, and I don’t want to be another dick to her like all the last guys she’s been with.

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Hi Thomas that’s a tough situation, but what you want and are offering is not a friendship. You hang out with your friends all the time and have fun without hoping for a romantic relationship. Sometimes you fall for the wrong one. I would say slowly separate yourself from her by hanging out less with her and start answering her less. Not in a mean manner, but the distance will help you both clear your feelings. You cannot get over someone if your constantly around them. Once your out of this situation I’m sure you’ll see it differently and find other friends and fall for someone else.

Don’t worry the good guys are the ones one should date and eventually the right girl will come along so don’t worry you have time since your only in high school.

Also, how did she respond when you told her you have feelings for her? I might of missed that part.

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Speak outloud your pain. Don’t be afraid to be vulnerable. If she responds negatively then she wasn’t even worth it. If she rejects you nicely then take the rejection and have a closure. Make sure you don’t come from a place of self compassion when you talk to her, make sure and be convinced that by doing it you will make your life better and probably hers.

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So, I tried telling her that I thought maybe we shouldn’t talk, but I couldn’t do it. She immediately got really upset and was like “You don’t want me in your life anymore?” I couldn’t do it. It hurts me so much that she doesn’t like me because again, I’m not an asshole like every other guy has been to her. Her friend told me she has commitment issues, and that is understandable as her last relationship last summer she told me after a year she ended up in heart break. I can’t tell her what to do, or how she should feel. But, she is just the nicest most innocent person I’ve ever met and I don’t know how I can get over her. I know the answer is easily just stop talking and don’t see her, but that isn’t fair to her either. We’re there for each other like family and you can’t walk away from something like that. I appreciate our relationship as it is and I know like people have said I should be happy and value the fact that I am friends with such a nice person, but I just don’t know how I can get over her if we are hanging out so much. But, she needs it, I am her motivation to pass her fitness test at college this summer. I am the one she turned to because I was a varsity track runner. So, I’m conflicted still, but I’m still chugging along. I know I need to just accept that things won’t change and we’ll never be a thing, but I just can’t because I was and am still certain she is the one. But, she’s going to college this fall and I’ll still only be a senior in high school, so there is definitely flaw in that mentality, but you just can’t beat love, especially when you see them all the time and you know that you still light up their world when they see you even if it isn’t because they love you romantically. I don’t know what to do because I don’t want to get over her, but I know I have to. I’m sorry, this thread has been going on so long, but it really helps me move along with all the great advice and tips people leave. Thank you so much.

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Pretty much everything I wanted to say has already been said, but one thing I do want to say is that you are not responsible for anyone else’s happiness. As much as I want to be there for my friends (including someone who I have a crush on), I’ve got to realize that no matter how much I care, sometimes I just have to move on. Sometimes “friends” will use you and it’s hard to see. Getting some distance and time away from this girl you have feelings for will help you get perspective on the situation. Please remember that the only person’s happiness that you are responsible for is your own.

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@thomasin34, what you’re describing is codependency. She depends on you to help her live. Even if there were no romantic feelings involved, even if she was your guy friend, that is not healthy for either of you. I’m not saying don’t help anyone; but help should be something you freely offer, not something that is expected or that you feel obligated to, nor something that you give with the hope that it will be reciprocated. You don’t give money to the Salvation Army bell-ringers at Christmas in hopes that they’ll offer you a warm bed; you give it cheerfully, knowing you’ll never see it again.

We’ve all had crushes. I think we could all say we’d do anything for our crushes, not because we expect that they’ll like us back, but because we hope it. You’re not being charitable, you’re trying to keep her in your life for hope’s sake, even though you admit it’s far-fetched. It’s like a former smoker sitting in a bar just to be around the smoke. She for her part knows that you would do anything for her, and so she leans into you (i.e. the fitness test that she ought to be able to pass all on her own), and if you left it would be mightily inconvenient for her. She’d be losing one of the tools in her toolbox. So she twists it around to make you the bad guy when "She immediately got really upset and was like ‘You don’t want me in your life anymore?’” She’s playing the victim, playing on your desire to be good to her by making you think you’re hurting her, and then giving your friendship just enough juice to keep you hanging on. I only know one real-life story where the guy who was “always there for her,” the “good friend,” finally got the girl. It took him 10 years of hanging around her like a puppy dog, and he never dated anyone else. Doesn’t that sound a little pathetic?

People like who they like. It’s not fair to the other person. You will never understand why she likes assholes instead of someone who will care for her like you would. I never did. It makes no sense. On the other hand, she doesn’t owe it to you to like you back, and thinking that she’ll eventually like you back if you’re always there for her is as selfish as it is fantastical.

As for what is and “isn’t fair to her either,” YOU DON’T OWE HER ANYTHING. To say you have some kind of familial obligation to her is an insult to all the people on this forum who are getting bled dry by their own flesh and blood relatives. You are pouring out your love in words of affirmation, acts of service, and quality time, all out of some twisted sense of obligation to your “friendship” and the distant hope that maybe one day she’ll come around. In the end, she’ll go off to college where I promise she will date the douchiest frat guys she can find, because from the sounds of things she doesn’t know who she is and she’s trying to find yourself, and that’s a process some people have to go through on the way to becoming themselves. Meanwhile you’ll have poured everything you had into loving her for nothing, and your views on women and dating will be soured for YEARS. I’ve been there.

It will hurt you to distance yourself from her. It will feel just like a breakup because you’ll be losing someone you love, even if there was never a “relationship.” There is no shortcutting that. She has already indicated that she’ll do what she can to make you feel like an uncaring, selfish, bad friend. It will hurt her too. But it’s best for you to cut out the cancer instead of letting it overtake you. You’ll have a new lease on life after several weeks, or maybe even months, of recovery. And when that happens, you can look around and see you’re surrounded by plenty of cute girls with good personalities who, if you hit it off with them, will like you for you, not just the help or emotional support you can provide them with. You’re an athlete and a good student with a good heart. You’ve got a lot going for you, and any girl would be lucky to have you. Giving yourself to someone who actually appreciates you is a huge act of self-love and self-respect.

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You are absolutely correct. I know that you guys are really telling the hard truth and that you’re really trying to help me out, so I greatly appreciate it. I have come to recognize that I am used by a lot of people lately. ESPECIALLY HER. So, I understand that things aren’t going to change. I knew that long before, but I don’t like to admit to myself that I know that deep down. All my guy friends are all saying the same thing though- that she is screwing with my head and holding me for her needs. So, I’ve just decided that I am going to try and talk and hang out with more different people (girls if possible too). A lot of people at work that didn’t really talk to me before have all been hanging out and talking to me more recently, so that’s taken a huge weight of my chest because I can think and do something with someone else other than her. I’m still helping her train, and she is getting faster. I in the process have began training too, so as much as it seems like a sucky situation I have been benefitting personally a little because otherwise I don’t think I’d have to motivation to go out on the track and train without someone like her also working hard with me.

But, thank you. I will heed your advice. I really am going to stop believing in the fantasy that things will work out. I realize how toxic it is of me to expect reciprocation from my good actions towards her because like you said you shouldn’t do something like donate money to charity and expect something in return- you do it to do it and be helpful from the heart, which while it may have been like that at first, and still a little to an extend, our relationship has evolved to me being desperate personally. So, I promise you all I’m done with living in the fantasy world. I’m going to start talking to more girls I know from school and work as well as other people and just move along, because I know the reality is that she’ll just keep making bad decisions and turn to me for it.

Again, really thank you all so much. I know I’ve dragged this thread along so long now and it’s probably getting old, but I think SheetMetalHead nailed it on the coffin this time. Here’s to new days!!

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